How To Make Numbering Work Right?

Hello. I have a problem which is driving me nuts. I posted this problem about
10 days ago, and Suzanne Barnhill was extremely helpful to me and taught me a
lot. (If you're reading this, Suzanne, thank you thank you! Do you MVPs
really do all this for free?)
Here's my problem. I'm a linguist, and in articles written in my field all
the example sentences have numbers beside them in parentheses, e.g. (1). And
references to them in the text look like that, too, e.g., 'as we can tell
from sentence (1),...'. I need those references to update automatically (by
pressing F9) when an extra example sentence is stuffed in somewhere. The way
I'm doing it is Insert|Field|Listnum with (none) chosen for Field properties.
And I insert my references by Insert|Reference|Cross-reference|Numbered item
(with reference to as 'Paragraph (no context)'). This works great. I get my
parentheses just like I want 'em. But I only managed get to work by blindly
banging at Word long ago until I finally lucked out. And I have determined
that all the information to make it work - the information that I want my
numbers in parentheses - is contained in a paragraph marker ('pilcrow') which
I have placed at the top of the document. Yes, it definitely is. If I remove
it, all my numbers switch to i), ii), iii), iv), etc. immediately. If I stuff
it back in, everything is (1), (2), (3), etc. just like I want it. And
whenever I want to write a new paper, I just copy in that pilcrow from a
previous document.
But now here's where the trouble comes in. I want my headings to appear in
the Document Map. In fact, it looks like they have to be actual Microsoft
Word Built-in headings or else based on them, since my ultimate goal is a PDF
and that's what they let you choose from. Anyway, as soon as I put in a
heading anywhere, or add a style like Suzanne taught me, and give it an
outline level, or even just select a heading I've typed into the body of the
document, and go to Format|Paragraph on the menu and specify the outline
level there... boom! all the utterance numbers after that heading jump to i),
ii), iii), etc. I find I can take my magic pilcrow and stuff a copy of it in
after the offending newly added heading, and it seems to fix things, but
that's a big nuisance to have to do after every heading. I BELIEVE I've been
able to base new headings on that, and they work, but I find that my magic
pilcrow is based on heading 3 (it has the word Auto after it, too, does that
matter?), and I need multiple outline levels, not all the same. If I try my
to switch my pilcrow from, say, outline level 3 to outline level 2, woops!
Now suddenly all my numbers go to i), ii), iii) again! What's wrong with
level 2? Why does my pilcrow work only for level 3? (Believe me, this
happened!) Arghh!

Peyton Todd

510-843-1568

Hi Peyton,

I am not the MVP to whom the SOS was sent, but some thoughts:

Dear heaven. I'm not near expert enough to help with this. Except that
really, what you want isn't that complicated--it's just that's it's become
complicated on your machine. But it probably isn't worth fixing, since the
magic pilcrow method is not best practice. Better to take outright control
of Word than to try to finagle its oddities like that.

If I were you, I would start from scratch, building a template that has the
formatting you require. Let's call it ArticleTemplate. Set ArticleTemplate
to use the built-in headings, but modify them as you desire.

You will have to do some work in transferring your old documents into this
template--probably the best way is to Insert | File the old doc into a blank
doc based on ArticleTemplate. You can use Find & Replace to replace one
style with another, and can even record a macro to do it. If you didn't
previously use styles, you will have to do it manually, it doesn't take as
long as you think.

So the only complicated thing, really, is how to get the sentences numbered
properly. Well, I don't know much about ListNum fields, so I go to Help, and
it appears that ListNum is designed to operate like outline numbering. The
first ListNum in a paragraph is 1), but the next is a), the third is i).
Well, I strongly suspect that isn't what you want, is it? (note that this
explains the odd behavior of the magic pilcrow)

You want all the examples in the document to go 1), 2), 3), right? There
are no 1a) examples? In one paragraph, you might have example 1) and
example 2)?

So perhaps ListNum is not the proper field for you to use. Actually, as
your example sentences are very parallel in structure to the use of
Equations or Figures in a document, Word's Caption field would make a lot of
sense. But I can't figure out how to get a blank caption that only includes
the number. But since Captions are just SEQ (sequence) fields, you should be
able to arrange SEQ fields that meet your needs. I don't know that much
about SEQ fields, but I'm sure someone will be able to help. Look up both
Captions and SEQ fields in Help to see what you can experiment with.

If you always refer to "sentence 1)" and not just "1)" the Caption field
should be the easiest way to go.

Post back with how this diagnosis/plan sounds to you, and any questions it
evokes, though I might not be able to answer them myself.

And answer these very important questions, that will complicate the above.
Do you need the headings to be outline-numbered, e.g., Section 1, SubSection
1.1?
Do the example numbers have any relation to the numbers of the heading?
E.g., examples 1.1 and 1.2 in section 1; then examples 2.1 and 2.2 in
section 2.

DM




On 12/14/04 11:43 PM, "Peyton Todd" wrote:

Hello. I have a problem which is driving me nuts. I posted this problem about
10 days ago, and Suzanne Barnhill was extremely helpful to me and taught me a
lot. (If you're reading this, Suzanne, thank you thank you! Do you MVPs
really do all this for free?)
Here's my problem. I'm a linguist, and in articles written in my field all
the example sentences have numbers beside them in parentheses, e.g. (1). And
references to them in the text look like that, too, e.g., 'as we can tell
from sentence (1),...'. I need those references to update automatically (by
pressing F9) when an extra example sentence is stuffed in somewhere. The way
I'm doing it is Insert|Field|Listnum with (none) chosen for Field properties.
And I insert my references by Insert|Reference|Cross-reference|Numbered item
(with reference to as 'Paragraph (no context)'). This works great. I get my
parentheses just like I want 'em. But I only managed get to work by blindly
banging at Word long ago until I finally lucked out. And I have determined
that all the information to make it work - the information that I want my
numbers in parentheses - is contained in a paragraph marker ('pilcrow') which
I have placed at the top of the document. Yes, it definitely is. If I remove
it, all my numbers switch to i), ii), iii), iv), etc. immediately. If I stuff
it back in, everything is (1), (2), (3), etc. just like I want it. And
whenever I want to write a new paper, I just copy in that pilcrow from a
previous document.
But now here's where the trouble comes in. I want my headings to appear in
the Document Map. In fact, it looks like they have to be actual Microsoft
Word Built-in headings or else based on them, since my ultimate goal is a PDF
and that's what they let you choose from. Anyway, as soon as I put in a
heading anywhere, or add a style like Suzanne taught me, and give it an
outline level, or even just select a heading I've typed into the body of the
document, and go to Format|Paragraph on the menu and specify the outline
level there... boom! all the utterance numbers after that heading jump to i),
ii), iii), etc. I find I can take my magic pilcrow and stuff a copy of it in
after the offending newly added heading, and it seems to fix things, but
that's a big nuisance to have to do after every heading. I BELIEVE I've been
able to base new headings on that, and they work, but I find that my magic
pilcrow is based on heading 3 (it has the word Auto after it, too, does that
matter?), and I need multiple outline levels, not all the same. If I try my
to switch my pilcrow from, say, outline level 3 to outline level 2, woops!
Now suddenly all my numbers go to i), ii), iii) again! What's wrong with
level 2? Why does my pilcrow work only for level 3? (Believe me, this
happened!) Arghh!

Peyton Todd

510-843-1568

Hi Daiya,

Thanks for your reply. What I'm after is numbering like (1), (2), etc. A
thousand apologies for posting the same question again, because a solution
which works for me had already been provided by Margaret Aldis, attached to
my earlier post on 12/6. I was too inexperienced with the Microsoft Newsgroup
system to be able to find that old posting again. Sorry. I learned a lot from
your posting and from Suzanne's, though. I expect yours might work, too.

Hers seemed particularly useful because I need to stuff these numbers inside
a single cell of a table - the reason for a table being that I'm writing an
e-book, and I need to place icons (actually .jpgs) to click on at various
particular places, and the layout of a table helps me do that.

Here is her solution:

'...what you need to do is set up the numbering format you need (using
Format Bullets and Numbering Outline Numbering) and give it a LISTNUM
field list name (you do this in the More .... section of the customize
dialog). Then when you insert a LISTNUM field you will see the name you
created in the 'List name' box - select this, check 'level in list' and set
to 1.'

Meanwhile, I have another question about margins, that I will post separately!

Thanks again,
Peyton


"Daiya Mitchell" wrote:

Hi Peyton,

I am not the MVP to whom the SOS was sent, but some thoughts:

Dear heaven. I'm not near expert enough to help with this. Except that
really, what you want isn't that complicated--it's just that's it's become
complicated on your machine. But it probably isn't worth fixing, since the
magic pilcrow method is not best practice. Better to take outright control
of Word than to try to finagle its oddities like that.

If I were you, I would start from scratch, building a template that has the
formatting you require. Let's call it ArticleTemplate. Set ArticleTemplate
to use the built-in headings, but modify them as you desire.

You will have to do some work in transferring your old documents into this
template--probably the best way is to Insert | File the old doc into a blank
doc based on ArticleTemplate. You can use Find & Replace to replace one
style with another, and can even record a macro to do it. If you didn't
previously use styles, you will have to do it manually, it doesn't take as
long as you think.

So the only complicated thing, really, is how to get the sentences numbered
properly. Well, I don't know much about ListNum fields, so I go to Help, and
it appears that ListNum is designed to operate like outline numbering. The
first ListNum in a paragraph is 1), but the next is a), the third is i).
Well, I strongly suspect that isn't what you want, is it? (note that this
explains the odd behavior of the magic pilcrow)

You want all the examples in the document to go 1), 2), 3), right? There
are no 1a) examples? In one paragraph, you might have example 1) and
example 2)?

So perhaps ListNum is not the proper field for you to use. Actually, as
your example sentences are very parallel in structure to the use of
Equations or Figures in a document, Word's Caption field would make a lot of
sense. But I can't figure out how to get a blank caption that only includes
the number. But since Captions are just SEQ (sequence) fields, you should be
able to arrange SEQ fields that meet your needs. I don't know that much
about SEQ fields, but I'm sure someone will be able to help. Look up both
Captions and SEQ fields in Help to see what you can experiment with.

If you always refer to "sentence 1)" and not just "1)" the Caption field
should be the easiest way to go.

Post back with how this diagnosis/plan sounds to you, and any questions it
evokes, though I might not be able to answer them myself.

And answer these very important questions, that will complicate the above.
Do you need the headings to be outline-numbered, e.g., Section 1, SubSection
1.1?
Do the example numbers have any relation to the numbers of the heading?
E.g., examples 1.1 and 1.2 in section 1; then examples 2.1 and 2.2 in
section 2.

DM




On 12/14/04 11:43 PM, "Peyton Todd" wrote:

Hello. I have a problem which is driving me nuts. I posted this problem about
10 days ago, and Suzanne Barnhill was extremely helpful to me and taught me a
lot. (If you're reading this, Suzanne, thank you thank you! Do you MVPs
really do all this for free?)
Here's my problem. I'm a linguist, and in articles written in my field all
the example sentences have numbers beside them in parentheses, e.g. (1). And
references to them in the text look like that, too, e.g., 'as we can tell
from sentence (1),...'. I need those references to update automatically (by
pressing F9) when an extra example sentence is stuffed in somewhere. The way
I'm doing it is Insert|Field|Listnum with (none) chosen for Field properties.
And I insert my references by Insert|Reference|Cross-reference|Numbered item
(with reference to as 'Paragraph (no context)'). This works great. I get my
parentheses just like I want 'em. But I only managed get to work by blindly
banging at Word long ago until I finally lucked out. And I have determined
that all the information to make it work - the information that I want my
numbers in parentheses - is contained in a paragraph marker ('pilcrow') which
I have placed at the top of the document. Yes, it definitely is. If I remove
it, all my numbers switch to i), ii), iii), iv), etc. immediately. If I stuff
it back in, everything is (1), (2), (3), etc. just like I want it. And
whenever I want to write a new paper, I just copy in that pilcrow from a
previous document.
But now here's where the trouble comes in. I want my headings to appear in
the Document Map. In fact, it looks like they have to be actual Microsoft
Word Built-in headings or else based on them, since my ultimate goal is a PDF
and that's what they let you choose from. Anyway, as soon as I put in a
heading anywhere, or add a style like Suzanne taught me, and give it an
outline level, or even just select a heading I've typed into the body of the
document, and go to Format|Paragraph on the menu and specify the outline
level there... boom! all the utterance numbers after that heading jump to i),
ii), iii), etc. I find I can take my magic pilcrow and stuff a copy of it in
after the offending newly added heading, and it seems to fix things, but
that's a big nuisance to have to do after every heading. I BELIEVE I've been
able to base new headings on that, and they work, but I find that my magic
pilcrow is based on heading 3 (it has the word Auto after it, too, does that
matter?), and I need multiple outline levels, not all the same. If I try my
to switch my pilcrow from, say, outline level 3 to outline level 2, woops!
Now suddenly all my numbers go to i), ii), iii) again! What's wrong with
level 2? Why does my pilcrow work only for level 3? (Believe me, this
happened!) Arghh!

Peyton Todd

510-843-1568