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FYI Word 2007 users who must have menus



 
 
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  #41  
Old April 24th, 2007, 06:36 PM posted to microsoft.public.word.newusers
Larry
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 151
Default FYI Word 2007 users who must have menus

Irony is famously dangerous to use in e-mail and online discussions where
people do not know each other and are not seeing each other face to face,
and it often leads to misunderstandings. The writer may think that his or
her comment is obviously ironic, but it may not appear that way to others.
This is especially the case when the comment is a criticism or attack.
Friends can kid each other this way because they know they're kidding. With
strangers it's different.

To say to someone, a complete stranger, "You might want to go in to have
your obsessive-compulsive levels checked," and then add the emoticon
indicating, "See, I didn't mean it, so don't hold me accountable for what I
just said," is not nice.

I have been attacked at this forum for attacking Word 2007. But I've never
used personally insulting language about anyone, which certain people in
this forum such as Greg have been doing.

And now I suppose I'll be attacked for what I just said.






"LurfysMa" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Apr 2007 21:46:52 -0400, "Larry"
wrote:

This has been very lively discussion. I thank LurfysMa for bravely

taking
my side against the massed might of the MVPs, though at the last moment

she
(and I assume from the name it's a she) seems to have changed her mind,
though maybe she's being ironic, on finding out that I still use Word 97.
But if she's not being ironic but means it, that's pretty funny, given

that
she herself uses Word 2000.


Geez, Larry, maybe your detractors are right. Yes, I was kidding you
and being ironic. Did you need to ask? You might want to go in to have
your obsessive-compulsive levels checked. ;-)

BTW: We are upgrading all of our computers soon and will be installing
Office 2007. That's why your post caught my eye. I'll let you know if
I agree with your opinion of the interface. Even if I like it, I still
consider MS arrogant and dismissive of the needs of many users. It's
primary customers are corporations who buy thousands of licenses. This
NG is one way MS gets a lot of hard-working folks to work for free
answering questions about the vagaries of their products. If they paid
the MVPs even half of what they are worth, many of them could quit
their day jobs.


--
Running Word 2000 SP-3 on Windows 2000


  #42  
Old April 25th, 2007, 05:31 PM posted to microsoft.public.word.newusers
Cindy M.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,428
Default FYI Word 2007 users who must have menus

Hi Beth,

Some may see it that way, but for me, the newsgroups help increase my
knowledge of the applications.You see, the newsgroups are a two-way street.
I learn something new every day, either by reading advice offered by others
or researching a question, and that makes me more of an asset in my
profession. There's only so much you can learn on your own. :-)

Exactly :-)

Plus, I learn about what concerns people and how different people see problems
from other angles.

Cindy Meister
INTER-Solutions, Switzerland
http://homepage.swissonline.ch/cindymeister (last update Jun 17 2005)
http://www.word.mvps.org

This reply is posted in the Newsgroup; please post any follow question or
reply in the newsgroup and not by e-mail :-)

  #43  
Old April 28th, 2007, 09:37 PM posted to microsoft.public.word.newusers
Doug Robbins - Word MVP
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8,239
Default FYI Word 2007 users who must have menus

That might be me to whom you are referring.

--
Hope this helps.

Please reply to the newsgroup unless you wish to avail yourself of my
services on a paid consulting basis.

Doug Robbins - Word MVP

"Beth Melton" wrote in message
...
I'm glad you posted this, Greg. :-)

Until now I was feeling like the only MVP who actually supports the new
version. (I know there are a few others but they're on the soft-spoken
side. ;-) )

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton


"Greg Maxey" wrote in message
...
Larry,

I have read many of your posts and your disappointment with Word2007 is
clearly evident. To be blunt you are beginning to sound like a broken
record.

I am not thrilled by it either, but there are many features that I like
and the more I use it my initial ire continues to diminish. I have spent
a little time playing with RibbonX custimaztion and while I am far from
proficient, I have been able to create some custom tabs and I am actually
quite satisfied with the result. I sent you an e-mail (or tried)
offering to send you a sample document with some simple ribbon
cusotomizations. I will still do that if you are interested.

Do you have a garage? If I recall correctly, Microsoft was born in a
garage. Why don't you design a word processing application in your
garage or similiar small space that satisfies all of your tastes and
requirement and market it? If you pull it off and there really are
millions of users and thousands of companies that feel the same as you
then your fortune is made.



--
Greg Maxey/Word MVP
See:
http://gregmaxey.mvps.org/word_tips.htm
For some helpful tips using Word.


Larry wrote:
Here's hoping that millions of users and thousands of companies react
as you have done, since apparently that is the only thing that will
persuade the people at Microsoft what a hideous catastrophe Word 2007
is.

Larry




"CS Hayes" wrote in message
...
FYI again

I am not very interested in old tool bars for new programs. I have
been using 2007 trial and sadly I'm not impressed. I do understand
that I will have to learn this software to be competitive in todays
workforce but I don't like it. I've spent years learning how to
manipulate software via menus and now I have to relearn how to do it
via ribbons (which is a fancy word for "over sized tool bar.") I'm
going to go to 2003 on my system once the trial runs out.

Here is an interesting idea: since someone can program a new tool
bar for 2007 could someone program an interface for language
compatibility with .NET for VB6? I think this would be something a
lot of people would be interested in.
--
Chris Hayes
Still a beginner (only 12 years)


"Cindy M." wrote:

Hi Chris,

And there's a more sophisticated tool that's just come out here. It
includes what the Chinese is offering (the "Lite" version), plus
one that lets you customize the menus, create your own toolbars,
and add your own macros and AutoText. The toolbar can also be
floated.

What's more, you can save each set of customizations - including
where the toolbars are located - in individual documents.

It costs 19.95 for a single license, with discounts for volume
licenses. And you can get 5% off by using the coupon code MVPCINDY

http://www.toolbartoggle.com

For those of you who must have the drop down menus fear no more.

A chinese developer has created an Add In for Office and it's
$29.00 (those folks are becoming quite the capitalists...)

http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,130635/article.html

Where there's a need there's a dollar.


Cindy Meister
INTER-Solutions, Switzerland
http://homepage.swissonline.ch/cindymeister (last update Jun 17
2005) http://www.word.mvps.org

This reply is posted in the Newsgroup; please post any follow
question or reply in the newsgroup and not by e-mail :-)







  #44  
Old April 28th, 2007, 09:41 PM posted to microsoft.public.word.newusers
Doug Robbins - Word MVP
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8,239
Default FYI Word 2007 users who must have menus

When you try 2007, try the Toolbar Toggle addin.

--
Hope this helps.

Please reply to the newsgroup unless you wish to avail yourself of my
services on a paid consulting basis.

Doug Robbins - Word MVP

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote in message
...
We were repeatedly told that there was no satisfactory way to provide a
"Classic" view for Word 2007, certainly not if the product was to meet its
release date. The fact that so far no add-in that attempts to provide that
view is totally satisfactory should be proof of this.

Word 2003 is and will continue to be fully supported for several more
versions; Word 97 is currently out of support and I believe Word 2000 as
well.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup
so
all may benefit.

"LurfysMa" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 23 Apr 2007 10:48:48 -0500, "Suzanne S. Barnhill"
wrote:

I suspect that the next version of Word may take some "backward" steps
to
accommodate those who were not ready for it. Holding fast with Word 2003

now
and then upgrading to Word 14 may be the best plan.


If that happens, then Larry has a much bigger complaint. If they were
(or are) going to do it, they should have (a) done it now or (b)
announced that they had this backup plan and 2003 would be fully
supported until it was ready.

Now I am getting madder.

--
Running Word 2000 SP-3 on Windows 2000




  #45  
Old May 4th, 2007, 03:27 AM posted to microsoft.public.word.newusers
Chris Hayes
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 19
Default FYI Word 2007 users who must have menus

Oh, this is a very good point! Bravo!

Microsoft has just gotten to the place where they "feel" and "can" do what
they want without regard to the user (especially the current users.)

I've been a strong MS user for years. I remember installing Office 95 with
3 3/4" floppys. I was barking at others to look at Word and not Word Perfect.

The problem is no one is coming up with a viable competetive product. The
solid base Microsoft has built with it's tools and methods gives them clout
to do what they want.

Microsoft kicking itself in the rear with a way off base new product (which
has plenty of new and fun tools) does not meet the current user base. This
is the competitions opportunity to come up with a viable new option (highly
unlikely though.)
--
Chris Hayes
Still a beginner (only 12 years)

[fyi, you can email me by getting rid of the British Comedian''s name who
wrote that song about "Spam"]


"LurfysMa" wrote:

On Sun, 22 Apr 2007 17:50:15 -0500, "Beth Melton"
wrote:

The "cheap shot", Larry, is spending a limited amount of time using Word
2007, forming quick and non-researched opinions, and then criticizing it
every chance you get.

I'm sure if I spent 5 to 10 minutes using "Larry's Word", and if I were one
to form quick and non-researched opinions, I'd think it was hideous, a
catastrophe, and a monstrosity - all because I haven't taken the time to use
it.

What you say takes months to learn really doesn't take that long at all.
Now, I spent months learning about the new features (which is true of any
new version), but I adapted to the UI fairly quickly. FWIW, I've been using
the Office applications, with the menus/toolbars, since 1985, starting with
Excel on a Mac. I went from using SuperCalc and WordStar with the slash
commands and I couldn't imagine how using a mouse would help me work faster
than my trusty keyboard navigation! But once I got the hang of using a mouse
I never looked back.

The UI you love was designed for 1989, just as the slash command nagivation
was designed for early computer applications. A lot has changed since then
and the programs outgrew the menu/toolbar system. I'm surprised they didn't
do this long ago.

I think the bottom line is, if you prefer to drive your 1950 Chevy with no
air conditioning, manual steering, manual transmission, and drum brakes,
then by all means, keep driving it. I prefer to drive my new convertible
with air conditioning, automatic steering, split shift transmission (can
switch to automatic or manual), anti-lock brakes, heated leather seats, GPS,
and 4-disc CD changer. I like my car and I'm tired of someone merely kicking
the tires and making assumptions about it.


Another point completely missed.

I never heard Larry tell you or Greg or anyone else not to use the new
interface. He just said that he hates it and hates that HE is forced
to use it or stay with an obsolete version.

Your car analogy is off the mark. Your shiny new car is 100%
compatible with existing roads, maps, gas stations, DMV procedures,
etc. When you bought it, you didn't need more than 5 minutes of
training to be able to drive away. When you upgraded, you didn't need
to learn new maps, build new roads, go back to driver's school, take a
new driver's test (unless you bought a bus), or anything. If your new
car has a fancy GPS system, or a satellite uplink, or a wet bar, or a
waterbed, it didn't affect your ability to drive down the road. And,
both you and Larry can drive down the same road at the same time
without either of you making any adjustments for each other.

Larry has a valid point. MS tends to make changes because they can. I
guarantee you, that Google Office is going to change that and I'm
cheering for Google -- until they become the arrogant 8 million pound
gorilla and start pushing people and customers around.

It took about 60 years for TJ Watson's lean, mean, responsive company
to become ossified and arrogant and get clipped my Microsoft. It's now
been about 20 years. MS is getting bloated and slow. They weathered
the Netscape scare just like IBM did early competitors by crushing
them. So far the open source folks (and other grass roots efforts)
have not quite got it together. But Google may just do to MS after 30
years what MS did to IBM after 60.

In the meantime, Larry, keep complaining. Even if I don't agree with
you. I'll just tune you out. ;-)

--
Running Word 2000 SP-3 on Windows 2000

  #46  
Old May 4th, 2007, 05:26 AM posted to microsoft.public.word.newusers
Graham Mayor
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 18,297
Default FYI Word 2007 users who must have menus

You have to wonder at the mind set of some of our software giants. Lotus
used to have a seriously good word processor - AmiPro - which was easier to
use than Word and did just about everything that a user might reasonably
need; and Lotus was then highly regarded, but they screwed it up and
introduced the ridiculous Word Pro as a replacement. Maybe the former Lotus
destroyers now work for Microsoft?

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org


Chris Hayes wrote:
Oh, this is a very good point! Bravo!

Microsoft has just gotten to the place where they "feel" and "can" do
what they want without regard to the user (especially the current
users.)

I've been a strong MS user for years. I remember installing Office
95 with 3 3/4" floppys. I was barking at others to look at Word and
not Word Perfect.

The problem is no one is coming up with a viable competetive product.
The solid base Microsoft has built with it's tools and methods gives
them clout to do what they want.

Microsoft kicking itself in the rear with a way off base new product
(which has plenty of new and fun tools) does not meet the current
user base. This is the competitions opportunity to come up with a
viable new option (highly unlikely though.)

On Sun, 22 Apr 2007 17:50:15 -0500, "Beth Melton"
wrote:

The "cheap shot", Larry, is spending a limited amount of time using
Word 2007, forming quick and non-researched opinions, and then
criticizing it every chance you get.

I'm sure if I spent 5 to 10 minutes using "Larry's Word", and if I
were one to form quick and non-researched opinions, I'd think it
was hideous, a catastrophe, and a monstrosity - all because I
haven't taken the time to use it.

What you say takes months to learn really doesn't take that long at
all. Now, I spent months learning about the new features (which is
true of any new version), but I adapted to the UI fairly quickly.
FWIW, I've been using the Office applications, with the
menus/toolbars, since 1985, starting with Excel on a Mac. I went
from using SuperCalc and WordStar with the slash commands and I
couldn't imagine how using a mouse would help me work faster than
my trusty keyboard navigation! But once I got the hang of using a
mouse I never looked back.

The UI you love was designed for 1989, just as the slash command
nagivation was designed for early computer applications. A lot has
changed since then and the programs outgrew the menu/toolbar
system. I'm surprised they didn't do this long ago.

I think the bottom line is, if you prefer to drive your 1950 Chevy
with no air conditioning, manual steering, manual transmission, and
drum brakes, then by all means, keep driving it. I prefer to drive
my new convertible with air conditioning, automatic steering, split
shift transmission (can switch to automatic or manual), anti-lock
brakes, heated leather seats, GPS, and 4-disc CD changer. I like my
car and I'm tired of someone merely kicking the tires and making
assumptions about it.


Another point completely missed.

I never heard Larry tell you or Greg or anyone else not to use the
new interface. He just said that he hates it and hates that HE is
forced to use it or stay with an obsolete version.

Your car analogy is off the mark. Your shiny new car is 100%
compatible with existing roads, maps, gas stations, DMV procedures,
etc. When you bought it, you didn't need more than 5 minutes of
training to be able to drive away. When you upgraded, you didn't need
to learn new maps, build new roads, go back to driver's school, take
a new driver's test (unless you bought a bus), or anything. If your
new car has a fancy GPS system, or a satellite uplink, or a wet bar,
or a waterbed, it didn't affect your ability to drive down the road.
And, both you and Larry can drive down the same road at the same time
without either of you making any adjustments for each other.

Larry has a valid point. MS tends to make changes because they can. I
guarantee you, that Google Office is going to change that and I'm
cheering for Google -- until they become the arrogant 8 million pound
gorilla and start pushing people and customers around.

It took about 60 years for TJ Watson's lean, mean, responsive company
to become ossified and arrogant and get clipped my Microsoft. It's
now been about 20 years. MS is getting bloated and slow. They
weathered the Netscape scare just like IBM did early competitors by
crushing them. So far the open source folks (and other grass roots
efforts) have not quite got it together. But Google may just do to
MS after 30 years what MS did to IBM after 60.

In the meantime, Larry, keep complaining. Even if I don't agree with
you. I'll just tune you out. ;-)

--
Running Word 2000 SP-3 on Windows 2000



  #47  
Old May 6th, 2007, 07:58 AM posted to microsoft.public.word.newusers
LurfysMa
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 190
Default FYI Word 2007 users who must have menus

On Thu, 3 May 2007 19:27:01 -0700, Chris Hayes
wrote:

Oh, this is a very good point! Bravo!

Microsoft has just gotten to the place where they "feel" and "can" do what
they want without regard to the user (especially the current users.)

I've been a strong MS user for years. I remember installing Office 95 with
3 3/4" floppys. I was barking at others to look at Word and not Word Perfect.

The problem is no one is coming up with a viable competetive product.


Hardly. Google office (docs & spreadsheets) is a very real threat to
M$FT. Nothing to install. Ever. No migration. No upgrades. No
licensing. Free.

Documents can be accessed from any PC anywhere in the world. Nothing
to take with you. Easily shared documents.

There are problems, of course. They have your data and there are those
ads. Millions and millions of ads.

The
solid base Microsoft has built with it's tools and methods gives them clout
to do what they want.

Microsoft kicking itself in the rear with a way off base new product (which
has plenty of new and fun tools) does not meet the current user base. This
is the competitions opportunity to come up with a viable new option (highly
unlikely though.)


Based on what?

IBM looked totally invincible for 50-60 years. Even faced multiple
anti-trust & monopoly actions. Then a college dropout stole an OS and
knocked them of their pedestal.

Now, less than 20 years later, Google is such a threat that M$FT is
trying to buy Yahoo to stay competitive.

Software is not like any busioness ever. The barriers to entry are
close to zero and the cost of distribution is getting close to zero,
too.

Stay tuned.

--
Running Word 2000 SP-3 on Windows 2000
  #48  
Old May 6th, 2007, 09:14 AM posted to microsoft.public.word.newusers
Terry Farrell
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,004
Default FYI Word 2007 users who must have menus

The problem for MS (as I see it) is that Google was there first and it works
brilliantly as a search tool. So millions of us have Google set as a home
page and use it all the time. Even if (as MS suggests) MSN search is as good
as Google, why would the Goggle-based users swap to MSN when they already
have a service that they are more than comfortable using.

Buying Yahoo is a mistake because that won't make Google users switch to MSN
and it may alienate some (anti-MS) Yahoo users and force them over to
Google.

To get users to switch, MSN needs a significant lead in search or Google
screws up. The only advantage I have found with MSN is that the MSN-Encarta
World Map is significantly better for route planning than Google Maps for
Eastern Europe and Asia: it isn't significant an advantage to stop me using
Google as my home page though.

Terry Farrell

"LurfysMa" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 3 May 2007 19:27:01 -0700, Chris Hayes
wrote:

Oh, this is a very good point! Bravo!

Microsoft has just gotten to the place where they "feel" and "can" do what
they want without regard to the user (especially the current users.)

I've been a strong MS user for years. I remember installing Office 95
with
3 3/4" floppys. I was barking at others to look at Word and not Word
Perfect.

The problem is no one is coming up with a viable competetive product.


Hardly. Google office (docs & spreadsheets) is a very real threat to
M$FT. Nothing to install. Ever. No migration. No upgrades. No
licensing. Free.

Documents can be accessed from any PC anywhere in the world. Nothing
to take with you. Easily shared documents.

There are problems, of course. They have your data and there are those
ads. Millions and millions of ads.

The
solid base Microsoft has built with it's tools and methods gives them
clout
to do what they want.

Microsoft kicking itself in the rear with a way off base new product
(which
has plenty of new and fun tools) does not meet the current user base.
This
is the competitions opportunity to come up with a viable new option
(highly
unlikely though.)


Based on what?

IBM looked totally invincible for 50-60 years. Even faced multiple
anti-trust & monopoly actions. Then a college dropout stole an OS and
knocked them of their pedestal.

Now, less than 20 years later, Google is such a threat that M$FT is
trying to buy Yahoo to stay competitive.

Software is not like any busioness ever. The barriers to entry are
close to zero and the cost of distribution is getting close to zero,
too.

Stay tuned.

--
Running Word 2000 SP-3 on Windows 2000


  #49  
Old May 7th, 2007, 03:44 PM posted to microsoft.public.word.newusers
Gordon
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,772
Default FYI Word 2007 users who must have menus

"Chris Hayes" wrote in message
...

The problem is no one is coming up with a viable competetive product.


If you don't need Outlook, then Open Office is a VERY viable competitive
product....


 




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