Outlook 2003 Rules and Junk E-mail

I found the following statement on the Outlook Tips web site
(http://www.outlook-tips.net/archives/2004/20040209.htm):

"Outlook 2003 SP1 runs rules before junk e-mail filter. Update your
installation if you haven't already."

In my case, this isn't so; in fact, it's just the opposite. I have verified
that I have Outlook 2003, SP1, and I've already done a "Detect and Repair".
Still, the junk e-mail filter seems to have priority over my rules. The #1
rule in my list is to permanently delete messages with "porn" words in the
subject or body and stop processing more rules. I still end up with such
messages in my Junk E-mail folder. Any ideas on why this may be? (POP3
account). Thanks.

That's a typo - RTM runs rules first, SP1 runs junk email first, then rules.
http://www.slipstick.com/emo/2005/up050901.htm#spam

--
Diane Poremsky [MVP - Outlook]
Author, Teach Yourself Outlook 2003 in 24 Hours
Coauthor, OneNote 2003 for Windows (Visual QuickStart Guide)
Author, Google and Other Search Engines (Visual QuickStart Guide)

Outlook Tips: http://www.outlook-tips.net/
Outlook & Exchange Solutions Center: http://www.slipstick.com
Join OneNote Tips mailing list: http://www.onenote-tips.net/


"PaulB" wrote in message
...
I found the following statement on the Outlook Tips web site
(http://www.outlook-tips.net/archives/2004/20040209.htm):

"Outlook 2003 SP1 runs rules before junk e-mail filter. Update your
installation if you haven't already."

In my case, this isn't so; in fact, it's just the opposite. I have
verified
that I have Outlook 2003, SP1, and I've already done a "Detect and
Repair".
Still, the junk e-mail filter seems to have priority over my rules. The #1
rule in my list is to permanently delete messages with "porn" words in the
subject or body and stop processing more rules. I still end up with such
messages in my Junk E-mail folder. Any ideas on why this may be? (POP3
account). Thanks.

Thanks, Diane. Since this is the case, I believe that Microsoft should give
you a choice of where in your rules stack to run the junk mail filter. The
problem with it now is that when you open the Junk folder to see if there are
any legitimate messages, you're confronted with a list of messages with
filthy words in the subjects. Not a happy sight if a child is watching.
OLK2000 allowed you to prioritize your junk filter. Microsoft broke that with
OLK2003.

"Diane Poremsky [MVP]" wrote:

That's a typo - RTM runs rules first, SP1 runs junk email first, then rules.
http://www.slipstick.com/emo/2005/up050901.htm#spam

--
Diane Poremsky [MVP - Outlook]
Author, Teach Yourself Outlook 2003 in 24 Hours
Coauthor, OneNote 2003 for Windows (Visual QuickStart Guide)
Author, Google and Other Search Engines (Visual QuickStart Guide)

Outlook Tips: http://www.outlook-tips.net/
Outlook & Exchange Solutions Center: http://www.slipstick.com
Join OneNote Tips mailing list: http://www.onenote-tips.net/


"PaulB" wrote in message
...
I found the following statement on the Outlook Tips web site
(http://www.outlook-tips.net/archives/2004/20040209.htm):

"Outlook 2003 SP1 runs rules before junk e-mail filter. Update your
installation if you haven't already."

In my case, this isn't so; in fact, it's just the opposite. I have
verified
that I have Outlook 2003, SP1, and I've already done a "Detect and
Repair".
Still, the junk e-mail filter seems to have priority over my rules. The #1
rule in my list is to permanently delete messages with "porn" words in the
subject or body and stop processing more rules. I still end up with such
messages in my Junk E-mail folder. Any ideas on why this may be? (POP3
account). Thanks.

Outlook 2000's junk filter was totally rules based and not very good. The
one for Ol2003 is Bayesian based. It has a much better antispam engine - not
unlike many of the antispam addins available for outlook.

In all honesty, using outlook to prevent kids from seeing bad words is a
poor way to protect them - get a good filter, like mailwasher, or enable
server side filtering so it's not brought into outlook in the first place.
(I would use mailwasher over antispam addins for outlook as it gets rid of
the spam before it gets to outlook - addins check for spam as outlook
downloads email.)

--
Diane Poremsky [MVP - Outlook]
Author, Teach Yourself Outlook 2003 in 24 Hours
Coauthor, OneNote 2003 for Windows (Visual QuickStart Guide)
Author, Google and Other Search Engines (Visual QuickStart Guide)

Outlook Tips: http://www.outlook-tips.net/
Outlook & Exchange Solutions Center: http://www.slipstick.com
Join OneNote Tips mailing list: http://www.onenote-tips.net/


"PaulB" wrote in message
...
Thanks, Diane. Since this is the case, I believe that Microsoft should
give
you a choice of where in your rules stack to run the junk mail filter. The
problem with it now is that when you open the Junk folder to see if there
are
any legitimate messages, you're confronted with a list of messages with
filthy words in the subjects. Not a happy sight if a child is watching.
OLK2000 allowed you to prioritize your junk filter. Microsoft broke that
with
OLK2003.

"Diane Poremsky [MVP]" wrote:

That's a typo - RTM runs rules first, SP1 runs junk email first, then
rules.
http://www.slipstick.com/emo/2005/up050901.htm#spam

--
Diane Poremsky [MVP - Outlook]
Author, Teach Yourself Outlook 2003 in 24 Hours
Coauthor, OneNote 2003 for Windows (Visual QuickStart Guide)
Author, Google and Other Search Engines (Visual QuickStart Guide)

Outlook Tips: http://www.outlook-tips.net/
Outlook & Exchange Solutions Center: http://www.slipstick.com
Join OneNote Tips mailing list: http://www.onenote-tips.net/


"PaulB" wrote in message
...
I found the following statement on the Outlook Tips web site
(http://www.outlook-tips.net/archives/2004/20040209.htm):

"Outlook 2003 SP1 runs rules before junk e-mail filter. Update your
installation if you haven't already."

In my case, this isn't so; in fact, it's just the opposite. I have
verified
that I have Outlook 2003, SP1, and I've already done a "Detect and
Repair".
Still, the junk e-mail filter seems to have priority over my rules. The
#1
rule in my list is to permanently delete messages with "porn" words in
the
subject or body and stop processing more rules. I still end up with
such
messages in my Junk E-mail folder. Any ideas on why this may be? (POP3
account). Thanks.

The user should be able to create a rule that permanently delete certain
content before reaching the Junk Mail folder. Either that or the user should
be able to create a rule that acts on the junk mail folder periodically.

The user has to view the messages in the junk mail folder because there are
false positives in the junk mail filter. It is frustrating to have to
manually run message rules on the junk mail folder before checking for false
positives.

There must be a fix for this.

"Diane Poremsky [MVP]" wrote:

Outlook 2000's junk filter was totally rules based and not very good. The
one for Ol2003 is Bayesian based. It has a much better antispam engine - not
unlike many of the antispam addins available for outlook.

In all honesty, using outlook to prevent kids from seeing bad words is a
poor way to protect them - get a good filter, like mailwasher, or enable
server side filtering so it's not brought into outlook in the first place.
(I would use mailwasher over antispam addins for outlook as it gets rid of
the spam before it gets to outlook - addins check for spam as outlook
downloads email.)

--
Diane Poremsky [MVP - Outlook]
Author, Teach Yourself Outlook 2003 in 24 Hours
Coauthor, OneNote 2003 for Windows (Visual QuickStart Guide)
Author, Google and Other Search Engines (Visual QuickStart Guide)

Outlook Tips: http://www.outlook-tips.net/
Outlook & Exchange Solutions Center: http://www.slipstick.com
Join OneNote Tips mailing list: http://www.onenote-tips.net/


"PaulB" wrote in message
...
Thanks, Diane. Since this is the case, I believe that Microsoft should
give
you a choice of where in your rules stack to run the junk mail filter. The
problem with it now is that when you open the Junk folder to see if there
are
any legitimate messages, you're confronted with a list of messages with
filthy words in the subjects. Not a happy sight if a child is watching.
OLK2000 allowed you to prioritize your junk filter. Microsoft broke that
with
OLK2003.

"Diane Poremsky [MVP]" wrote:

That's a typo - RTM runs rules first, SP1 runs junk email first, then
rules.
http://www.slipstick.com/emo/2005/up050901.htm#spam

--
Diane Poremsky [MVP - Outlook]
Author, Teach Yourself Outlook 2003 in 24 Hours
Coauthor, OneNote 2003 for Windows (Visual QuickStart Guide)
Author, Google and Other Search Engines (Visual QuickStart Guide)

Outlook Tips: http://www.outlook-tips.net/
Outlook & Exchange Solutions Center: http://www.slipstick.com
Join OneNote Tips mailing list: http://www.onenote-tips.net/


"PaulB" wrote in message
...
I found the following statement on the Outlook Tips web site
(http://www.outlook-tips.net/archives...20040209.htm):

"Outlook 2003 SP1 runs rules before junk e-mail filter. Update your
installation if you haven't already."

In my case, this isn't so; in fact, it's just the opposite. I have
verified
that I have Outlook 2003, SP1, and I've already done a "Detect and
Repair".
Still, the junk e-mail filter seems to have priority over my rules. The
#1
rule in my list is to permanently delete messages with "porn" words in
the
subject or body and stop processing more rules. I still end up with
such
messages in my Junk E-mail folder. Any ideas on why this may be? (POP3
account). Thanks.

rshiras wrote:

The user should be able to create a rule that permanently delete
certain content before reaching the Junk Mail folder. Either that or
the user should be able to create a rule that acts on the junk mail
folder periodically.

Make a wish: write to outwish at microsoft dot com

The user has to view the messages in the junk mail folder because
there are false positives in the junk mail filter. It is frustrating
to have to manually run message rules on the junk mail folder before
checking for false positives.

There must be a fix for this.

Why "must" there be? It's operating as Microsoft wrote it. Outlook 2003
prior to SP1 did run rules before the junk e-mail filter but enough people
complained that their rules moved junk to their various folders that
Microsoft changed the behavior (making the choice for the user population
instead of giving people an option to configure it the way thet want).
--
Brian Tillman

There must be a choice. Some users want control over the kind of content
they want permanently deleted before going to the junk e-mail folder.
Microsoft may think they are doing what users want, but they are actually
doing what spammers want by forcing users to view junk mail that would
otherwise be permanently deleted. In this way, Microsoft is aiding and
abetting spammers!

"Brian Tillman" wrote:

rshiras wrote:

The user should be able to create a rule that permanently delete
certain content before reaching the Junk Mail folder. Either that or
the user should be able to create a rule that acts on the junk mail
folder periodically.

Make a wish: write to outwish at microsoft dot com

The user has to view the messages in the junk mail folder because
there are false positives in the junk mail filter. It is frustrating
to have to manually run message rules on the junk mail folder before
checking for false positives.

There must be a fix for this.

Why "must" there be? It's operating as Microsoft wrote it. Outlook 2003
prior to SP1 did run rules before the junk e-mail filter but enough people
complained that their rules moved junk to their various folders that
Microsoft changed the behavior (making the choice for the user population
instead of giving people an option to configure it the way thet want).
--
Brian Tillman

rshiras wrote:

There must be a choice.

You're wrong. There isn't a choice. Perhaps you mean "there _should_ be a
choice," but that's not usually how Microsoft operates.
--
Brian Tillman

You're right about how Microsoft operates. That doesn't chage the fact that
there shoulc be an option added to run a rule before the junk e-mail filter,
because without that option, Microsoft is aiding and abetting spammers.

"Brian Tillman" wrote:

rshiras wrote:

There must be a choice.

You're wrong. There isn't a choice. Perhaps you mean "there _should_ be a
choice," but that's not usually how Microsoft operates.
--
Brian Tillman

rshiras wrote:

You're right about how Microsoft operates. That doesn't chage the
fact that there shoulc be an option added to run a rule before the
junk e-mail filter, because without that option, Microsoft is aiding
and abetting spammers.

I do agree that there should be a setting. You said, however, there "must"
be one. Those two words aren't synonymous.
--
Brian Tillman